Comes word that Mary Cain is no longer running for Bronxville. A junior, she is now under the tutelage of Alberto Salazar, who is coaching her from Oregon with a local runner acting as the on-the-site presence.
While she could get away with running on her own for track, there was going to be problems when cross started, given that it is a team sport. Shortly before the season began, the boys’ coaches who had coached her in track quit as coaches.
Although being compelled to go back with the girls’ coach might have succeeded in getting everyone back on the same page and, as I’ve noted before, gotten her to be part of the high-school team experience, it was not be. It was never to be.
Bronxville’s girls have a long history of excellence, under coach Jim Mitchell (who, strangely, is referred to as “Mitchell” by girls on the team and, not so strangely, as “Mitch” by parents) and that tradition will continue. I think everyone is relieved that the curtain has closed on this drama.
Cain is not leaving the school, where she’s a straight-A student I’ve heard described as “scary smart”. But Wesley Crusher-like will be taking her talents elsewhere.
We wouldn’t think twice about an exceptional musician going into the City after school for lessons and not playing with the school band. Should a runner be any different. On LetsRun there was a thread in which several posters said that excellence requires a professional approach.
I differ on two fronts. First, the US has a plethora of world-class middle-distance runners, presumably who made it without the professional-touch in high school.
Second, as I said when I called Cain’s father’s statement that she needed to leave Jim Mitchell because his daughter “‘needed that individualized attention'” BS, she got to the extraordinary level she’s achieved with the coaching she already had, the outstanding freshman track and sophomore cross season under Mitchell and the outstanding outdoor track sophomore season under Ed Stickles and Julio German. Now Salazar is going to fix form-defects he sees with her, although I think she has the best form this side of Bernard Lagat.
There was concern about having Cain run a normal HSer’s schedule. She had to run a certain number of XC races to qualify for the States, but she skipped the season’s first because, as her-then coach Mitchell said, she had a very long track season so he wasn’t hurrying her. Plus she was winning the races she did run by quite a ways. Putting it all together, my assumption was that even is she ran races, her training would have been geared toward spring track. She’d likely win races as a workout.
Who knows. In the end, this is best at least for Bronxville. Whether it is best for Mary Cain remains to be seen. She’s now Salazar’s new project.
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October 21, 2012 at 2:18 pm
Joe Phlogiston
I think this is a terrific plum for Mary and her family. And yet does not come without the sacrifice of time and money. The athletic department at Bronxville School does a great job of protecting its student athletes. Merely having an additional team strength coach, or any assistant coach, for a high school athletic team on school premises requires at a minimum: fingerprinting, insurance bondings and a background check. And in the end, generally discouraged. The logistics of finding a community track for private coaching exclusive of other students will present itself as challenge, but not insurmountable. And this new direction is a testament to her determination and her family’s support. Coach Mitchell, once again, has helped another woman blossom from a catepillar into a butterfly. Now its time to fly.
October 22, 2012 at 12:35 pm
JoeGarland
Insofar as I’ve heard from anyone involved, it’s heartening to see universal enthusiasm and good wishes to Mary Cain.
Of course, finding a track that, unlike Bronxville’s, is actually 400 meters would itself be a blessing. I assume she’ll have an Armory pass. Lot of smart folks involved and they’ll figure it out.
October 22, 2012 at 10:34 am
Mans
Dear cry baby,
Sorry your friends feelings got hurt. She is above team running. Look what “team” got German and Derrick.
October 22, 2012 at 12:06 pm
Mystified
The most interesting part of this blog was the second paragraph. “Shortly before the season began, the boys’ coaches who had coached her in track quit as coaches.” That screams for an explanation. Mary Cain’s coach quits before the season and no explanation is given? The writer just dismisses it, suggesting that Mary should simply run for a girls coach. Do we really think so little of the U.S. coaching profession to suggest that some random HS coach is every bit as good as our top professional coach and former Olympic runner. What am I missing here?
Great to see that Salazar is trying to move elite coaching down to the H.S. level. Why isn’t the USATF following their soccer counterparts and doing the same? It’s no wonder why the U.S. distance runners can’t compete with the Africans.
October 22, 2012 at 12:24 pm
JoeGarland
I did not mean to be circumspect but I do not know why the boys’ coaches quit. Whether some “random HS coach” would take over is irrelevant because the girls’ coach at Bronxville has a decades-long history of coaching girls successfully. I would venture that for a school its size Bronxville’s cross teams historically are among the best in the USA for years and years, and they are surely that in New York, all under Jim Mitchell.
This was the same coach who got Mary Cain to a 2:03.74 relay leg (the team ran 8:49) and 4:17 1500 as a freshman (or, more precisely, provided coaching to a phenomenal talent) and to a 6th at NXN cross as a sophomore for one who is an 800/1500 specialist. I said this in the post.
You mention soccer, and there was a recent piece in the Times about US Soccer now requiring prospects to give up on HS teams if they want to be in a regional academy. It is a legitimate point.
A fundamental question is whether that model is appropriate for running. I don’t know about competing against East Africans in the 5,000 and 10,000 (and I’ll grant you that while Goucher and Flanagan have medals they were not competitive in those races) but the US has not been doing poorly of late in the 1500.
October 22, 2012 at 1:29 pm
JoeGarland
Also, I don’t know whether Salazar is “our top professional coach”. I do know he’ll be based in Oregon and that some who is not “our top professional coach” will be on-site. And if you’re wondering where Bronxville is, it is not far from Rye.
October 22, 2012 at 6:10 pm
Saul
You’re correct about her coach getting her to those 2:03 and 4:17 times. He seems to be an extremely good coach at the high school level. I’ll repeat that, high school level, but Mary and her family are possibly looking to the future and becoming an elite athlete. That’s where an elite coach would be needed as well as every resource they can promise her when she decides to turn pro. I think its a smart move. Look what Salazar did for Galen Rupp.
October 22, 2012 at 6:21 pm
JoeGarland
I guess I don’t understand why “high-school level” is so different from the pros. It’s not as though the three-point line is farther out or the passes are so much faster. OK, in Europe there’s a lot more contact in races. Otherwise, training is training to run fast. Sure I understand that there’s more to training-to-run than just running. But why an elite coach is “needed” is what I don’t get. Again I point to Americans’ recent success in the 1500.
If the predicate is that a high-school coach will treat her like all her other minions and have her run relays and dual meets, etc., I know of no reason to say that.
October 23, 2012 at 2:01 am
Ewen
1976! You’re making me feel old Joe.
I hope she does well and continues to enjoy her running. She’s 16? So another 3-4 years in the junior ranks. It takes a special coach/athlete relationship to take an athlete from that age through to being a ‘pro’ (whatever that means) in open competition. I presume she’d be targeting the 8/15 rather than the 5/10k initially (Salazar’s speciality). Maybe she’ll end up being a 15/5k runner. Anyway, I’ll be interested to see how she goes now that she’s gone.
October 23, 2012 at 7:40 am
stcary
Joe, quick question… are we really that competitive in the 1500m, or is the world just weak in that event right now? Let’s be honest here, we haven’t had a woman reach the level of being able to consistently run under 4:00 for the 1500m in a long time. I say consistently, but really what I mean is more than once… Come on, I don’t agree that she’s excluding herself from her school team in cross country, but it comes down to what she feels like is the best opportunity for her. I don’t know all of the details, but there is no doubt that Salazar has what it takes to win at the international level. That seems to be what she’s going after. Lay off the criticism a bit… you’re talking about a high school runner, not a pro. Give this a rest.
October 23, 2012 at 9:07 am
Abe
Excuse me for seeming critical of the Salazar, the running god. However, to me it smacks of him just trying to sink his teeth early into an extraordinary talent before someone else, to enhance his glowing reputation. One positive feature of Salazar’s methods is to bring things along slowly with long term goals the focus. To me, in this would be to let Mary continue her high school career in a normal fashion where her advancement and success have been phenomenal. There will be plenty of time down the road for professional coaching.
October 23, 2012 at 12:20 pm
james
Does anyone else remember the last HS female runner Alberto reached out to coach? Hint: HS record holder at 5k at the time and attended Granite Bay HS in NorCal. What happened to that?
October 23, 2012 at 12:50 pm
David Hager
If Mary lived in any other country, she would have already been receiving national level coaching. The problem here is, she is behind the curve, not ahead of it. She was certainly not going to receive any help from our ivory tower USATF, so she is lucky to get a coach that will prevent burn-out.
October 23, 2012 at 1:14 pm
JoeGarland
I don’t understand what “national level coaching” is and why it would make a difference. Is track the type of sport in which one is irretrievably lost if not sent to some academy in Florida by the age of 15? What curve is she behind?
A good point was raised by stcary: is the US really successful in the women’s 1500 since it doesn’t have anyone who can consistently go sub-4? In each of the last 3 championship finals there was at least 1 American in the mix through 1200 and there were medals in 2 of those races. That seems to be proof of something. Morgan Uceny played basketball and ran track in high school. Jenny Simpson was a high-school and CU star.
If your point is a concern with burnout, it’s a legitimate one. Yet there is no reason to think that care would not have been taken otherwise.
October 24, 2012 at 1:18 am
Ewen
I don’t think there’s any difference Joe. There’s good coaching, bad coaching and everything inbetween. For example, Sally Pearson has been with the same coach (Sharon Hannan) since primary school (age 8) and she wasn’t a national level coach back then. The coach/athlete relationship is the important thing.
Both the men’s and women’s 1500s are fairly open at the international level. Tactics, experience and finishing speed are more imporant than the ability to run an exceptionally fast time. If she can run close to 4 she can do well, especially as many of the EPO cheats have been caught/scared off in recent years.
Looking forward to seeing how Mary goes in the Central Park 5k.
October 23, 2012 at 6:34 pm
cg9m
been following this thread all day, and i guess i have 2 q’s.
1- you’re acting on the assumption that a high school ‘team experience’ is a ‘rite of passage’ that every good runner should have on their resume. period. but is it really right for every kid? you yourself (albeit as an adult, with experience of several groups), left a club (the former ssrmc, now new rochelle-something-or-other) b/c you disagreed with its core philosophy and had some personality clashes. i’d say you had that luxury. in high school, you’re kinda stuck. if this young woman is experiencing the pettiness/jealousy i’m sure she is, it really could be akin to hazing to forcibly subject her to running on her ‘team’! you’ve mentioned the acrimony went both ways, but she’s got a right to stick up for herself, too. the girls’ track coach may be a great guy in general, and a great running coach for many. it doesn’t mean he’s right for her, tho. again, in the adult corporate world (and team sports are often promoted as good prep for that), a great manager can bring out the best in all personality types. but in reality, most are adept only at mentoring those who are most like themselves. it may not be a good fit for her. she may have achieved what she did under this coach based on her talent alone. i saw it 30 years ago at my hs, where the girls track coach was also the boys varsity bball coach. he had that ‘tough guy’ mindset. called us all by our last names. three of the most talented runners quit and left to other sports. would you want that for this young woman? i do think it’s good from what i’ve read here and in the papers that all of the players in this game seem to want her to succeed. but the fact that insignificant folks like us are debating her nascent career is frankly a little frightening. it means she’s already under a microscope of unbelievable scrutiny. there’s no way she’s leading a ‘normal high school childhood’.
2- has nothing to do with this thread. i think i will post it later under the appropriate topic. but had a lively discussion this past weekend with some runners (from all over the US, interestingly), about the nyc marathon and whether it should go the way of boston and be limited to qualifiers. and if chicago should follow suit. it was a pretty good topic.
October 24, 2012 at 6:04 pm
Mark Thompson
Recently I read, or more accurately listened to on CD, The Perfect Mile by Neal Bascomb which as you might remember was about the quest by three runners to be the first to break the four minute mile. One of those runners, Wes Santee, was frustrated because he was required by his school to enter multiple events to score for his team, and that impacted his chances of breaking the four minute barrier.
He was competing for a major university, but a runner’s yearly high school schedule is not easy either. You have a cross country season where you’re racing once a week, a few weeks off followed by the indoor season with its various meets, followed by the outdoor season. In duel meets I was doing four events. It was fun, but it also meant a lot of stress on my body, and senior year I ended up injured for most of the season.
I can’t comment on the politics or personalities involved in Bronxville, but I think Mary and her dad are doing the right thing, if she’s following a good program involving quality training, good competition, and rest and recovery.
October 24, 2012 at 8:44 pm
JoeGarland
Mark, I’m pretty sure the Bronxville girls aren’t being run into the ground. The team also has the advantage of being good enough that it doesn’t have to be at 100% strength and 100% effort week-after-week and on the track girls get to run different distances in different weeks and no need to get lots of points out of a couple of runners. I remember when I did double in HS, the second one was the mile relay, last race of the meet, and that was always fun (perhaps because we almost always won and Lew Monday and I used a blind stick-pass for our exchange).
November 6, 2012 at 11:15 pm
cg9m
she could always go the way of ryan hall?
November 7, 2012 at 12:03 am
stcary
Joe, you seem very partial towards Bronxville’s coach/team here… is it possible, that maybe Bronxville just wasn’t a good fit for Mary anymore? I mean, sometimes change is good. I think we need to stop questioning the girl and let her run.
November 9, 2012 at 9:24 pm
JoeGarland
I’ve never questioned Mary Cain. I’ve said that I think it unfortunate that she is not experiencing the high-school cross experience, which was a major part of high school for me but someone to whom I made this comment recently said, “she’s had that experience already”. I said I felt sorry for her not being part of a team. That’s all.
With regard to the coaching situation — and I note that the Bronxville girls just won section 1 merge without their number 1 (not Cain, but someone who’s been injured) with a remarkable show of depth, scoring 15, 17, 19, 20, and 27).
My partiality is simply in reaction to those who say the coaching isn’t good enough for Cain. There may be other dynamics in play, or I should say there were”, but I bristle at that bogus view.
February 4, 2013 at 7:16 am
Doug Humphries
She doesn’t need to have special coaching at this point. It’s more important what she does from 18 to 30. If she can survive college without being injured and develop into a National or even World Class Runner in the long run is the more critical evolution. Look what happened to at least 90% of our greatest High School runners either male or female. Some never develop because of injuries or plain mental burnout. She should be there in the National High School Cross Country finals with her peers and set whatever records she can and move forward after graduation. Will Sarah Baxter of Saugus, Calif ever get a head to head race with Mary Cain if Cain no longer participates in High School races ? All Cain really needs is one good training partner (hopefully a 9:20 or better 2 miler) from the Bronxville boys team. Remember, Mary Decker’s career wasn’t what you would call “smooth sailing” from the Shin Splints to Zola Budd.
February 6, 2013 at 1:03 am
Ewen
Did you see the 2 mile HS indoor record Joe? I was impressed with how she stayed off the early pace and came through in the last few laps. Looked pretty smooth. I guess having Alberto cheering her on was pretty motivating.
November 10, 2016 at 12:37 am
cg9m
re-reading all of this i just can’t get my head around that #road racers don’t think you’re an #asshole for #trailracers
please let all of us just go and accomplish what we are meant to…much of which may be far more than this blog can attempt
November 11, 2016 at 7:54 pm
JoeGarland
I don’t understand what the first paragraph is saying but I’m guessing it’s not complimentary. Not so clear about the second paragraph either although it seems that you’re saying that people should strive to, in this context, run as well as they’re capable of running. I’m all for that but also the let people do whatever it is that makes them happy.
November 11, 2016 at 9:10 pm
Doug Humphries
I agree that almost 3 years after this discussion ended all of a sudden we get an unintelligible possibly alcohol inspired comment from cg9m who’s previous comments were completely coherent. What was the use of stupid “Hashtags” # supposed to signify. Save those for use on Twitter ! This topic is Moot at this point until the next prodigy does the same thing.
November 12, 2016 at 7:27 pm
cg9m
i thought of you while tweeting about the 2016 elections…i associate your character as portrayed in this blog strongly with Trump. on twitter, i’d definitely hashtag you wrt comments such as being “girled” in races and other anti-women comments you’ve made in this blog (particularly against mary wittenberg/nyrr and paula radcliffe/WRs) and definitely in this post. your comments on mary cain disgust me b/c they attack a *child* (at the time, and i’m a parent) and one of the most potentially talented female athletes of all time. in this post you very clearly seem against the idea that a woman can or should succeed on her own terms..not everyone is cut out for “teams”- again, something i would hashtag on twitter..i’m sorry for the blog-irrelevant hashtags on what was an emotional response to what i see as a very relevant and negative perception of women and their abilities in these times.
November 12, 2016 at 7:52 pm
JoeGarland
Legitimate points, and I appreciate your clarification.
“Girled”: I admit that might not be the best way to describe it but it is actually the way it is described. Let me give you my perspective, and I admit that in retrospect it was inappropriate. I used the term once about someone else, but I should not have. When I was young, I was at a level comparable with top women-runners. So to an extent I pegged my performance to that, since I could not as to the top men. So Grete Waitz beat me in the 1983 NYC Marathon, and I beat her in 1984 in the Trevira Twosome. And then there came a point when I did not care who beat me; I was only trying to run as fast as I could.
As to Paula Radcliffe, if I recall I merely tried to distinguish between a record-while-being-paced and one that was not. To me, that was the antithesis of misogyny in that I thought it belied a woman performing free of the tethers of men, and, as I recall, there was a good deal of back and forth on that and, as I further recall, my comment was directed at women and inquired as to whether they felt pacing lessened the result and there was a fair amount of comment on this issue which actually educated me, which is one of the purposes of this blog.
As to Mary Wittenberg, you’ll need to enlighten me as to anything that I wrote that comments about her as a woman, as opposed to as the then-president of NYRR.
Finally, Mary Cain. I need you to identify anything that I wrote that attacked her, including in this post. I may have expressed opinions about her, yet I don’t think I said anything mean about her (and I know that there are people close to her and perhaps she herself who’ll disagree). I may be delusional and I am, as always, ready to admit I was wrong when I am.
November 12, 2016 at 7:58 pm
cg9m
and the first comment was just a continuation of the hashtag-racers vs hashtag-runners debate that was ongoing on this blog for years, and which, i agree, should be dead horse-and-gone and i’m sorry i brought it up again other than that the election made me think of it..type a’s vs type b’s. nothing achieved.
but re trail runners, you went out of your way to condemn the ‘born to run’ crowd, troll them, and accuse them of thinking that a “don’t-worry-be-happy” mentality was better than a “racing” (excuse me- hashtag-racing) one was. i have come to believe that those folks weren’t striving for a better-than-thou running ideology, only an alternative one. and one that i happen to agree with of late.
it’s not like you and i race the same races anymore or know anyone in common anymore, so i’ll just continue on my perception of your blog…all of your posts on african-american immigrants…the ones about westchester tri club. those. you can’t deal with them winning races over “american” clubs- or coming here to better their futures or help their families back home. why, i mean, (hashtag)-warrenstreet has *french* runners for god’s sake, so they’re “ok” b/c they accept immigrants.. why don’t you go to one of mike barnow’s rockies winter workouts and meet some of the african runners this year? i think that would be good for you.
and, haha..finally, b/c i don’t really want to post here anymore- i think there are bigger fish to fry (for me, even)…but your posts on caster semenya (LGBTQ) and disabled runners also smacked of prejudice and conceit. i am *truly* at a loss as to why you have so many supporters in the running community except that people are blinded by “speed”. it just shows what values people will put aside to court “success” and it is a factor in why a fascist can win an election.
November 12, 2016 at 8:11 pm
cg9m
joe, the comments on mary cain that you posted here totally reflect what i’ve seen on hashtag-letsrun…i think those comments are *very* responsible for her curtailing her competitive career (at least hopefully) for the time being. the comments on hashtag-letsrun have been extraordinarily misogynstic…if you want to better the world for women, maybe start by supporting female athletes and not tearing them down or questioning their coaching decisions…there are plenty of female athletes who have issues with male coaches for a variety of reasons…(not saying there can’t be issues w/female coaches for other reasons- jealously, etc)…but, support them. don’t tear them down- cain, efraimson are leaders of a pack of (hashtag)american girls! maybe one of them will beat the guys, or some of them..be proud!
November 12, 2016 at 8:56 pm
JoeGarland
Just point me to what I’ve said that you find offense.
As to LetsRun, I agree that far too many of those comments are way out of line. Here’s my view. I think that she might well have been better off with a particular coach other than Salazar — a local coach who had coached world-class women athletes — but that she made that decision and I don’t think I criticized it. (Of course, on LetsRun an athlete who says “hello” to Salazar is either canonized or damned; I don’t go there anymore.) My view, which I’ve never expressed, is that once an athlete picks a coach it’s important that she commit to that coach and trust her and ignore what naysayers will say. Ignore the inevitable second-guessing. From what I knew, it was a well thought-out decision of her and her family. I don’t know whether all of the LRC comments were misogynistic — note the comments regarding Rupp — but the were not helpful. But I think you are correct that there is more criticism, more second-guessing of female athletes than of male and that is wrong and, yes, misogynistic.
If you’re wondering, with the exception of a post on LRC years ago in which I made a comment about Cain and her teammates, I made no comments about her anonymously. I’ll admit that while I tried not to post anything negative about her, people close to her thought I did. (Hence the removal of the snarky trails-comment to which I refer.) But please look at my posts again. My perspective was that her father unfairly maligned B’ville’s coach and that I thought she would miss being part of a team.
I’ve not posted here or anywhere anything about her in a long time, since she was gone. I, and everyone that I know who know her, wish her well.
Interestingly, there’s one world-class woman about whom I’ve spoken with a mutual friend who went the other way, i.e., from a woman coach to a man. But I just don’t know what the dynamic is between athletes and coaches of different genders (in track or in other sports), but that’s a whole different discussion.
November 12, 2016 at 8:36 pm
JoeGarland
This has got to stop. This post accuses me of a myriad of sins but I need you to point to posts that justify criticism. “caster semenay”? I searched. Neither “caster” nor “semanya” appear except for a reference to a “stratocaster” and to a “broadcaster”. “African-Americans”? The closes I came was the statement that “Africans” generally win the Rye Derby.
“Disable” appears nowhere in the blog. I mocked triathletes, and then admitted I was wrong.
“Immigrants”? I quoted a story about Velolib and vandalism performed in Paris by immigrants.
In the end, and I know you and have offered you the opportunity to put up your own, unfiltered, unedited post on this blog, this comment and the preceding one is fantasy. I agree that I have made comments that were overwrought and have made comments that were wrong, and when I think they are wrong I’ve admitted it. I have in fact deleted one of my posts and it was, of all things, because it was snarky about Mary Cain (about her not running on local trails). I’ve never deleted a critical comment because I think I have an obligation to respond to it instead of deleting it.
But you list a series of supposed statements by me that not only I don’t recall making and that a search does not reveal — as always I’m ready to acknowledge the contrary — and what you claim that I said are not what I believe.
You call me racist,and I can’t understand why you would. I’ve never said or thought that there was anything wrong about guys from east Africa, under Mike Barnow’s tutelage or otherwise, running and winning races. If there’s anything in this blog to which you go to great lengths to criticize is my praise of speed uber alles. That is not true, by the way, but why would I for a moment criticize someone who works untold hours doing menial labor, squeezing training in, and picking up some cash at a week-end 10K?
Triathletes? I admitted I was wrong and that they are athletes just as much as runners or bikers or swimmers are and that I could never do the stuff that they do.
I just don’t understand it, I genuinely don’t understand it. We’ve had our differences on this blog and, frankly, I have found your comments generally constructive because you’ve highlighted blindspots that I have and contributed to my realization that things are not as black-and-white as I might have thought in my younger, less mature days. But I just don’t understand this latest assault, this Trump equivalency.
It saddens me.
November 12, 2016 at 9:42 pm
cg9m
omg! re-read my post please and know that i did NOT spell hash-semenya improperly…
November 12, 2016 at 9:50 pm
JoeGarland
You are correct. I misspelled. In two different ways. Still, “semenya” does not appear in any of my posts.
November 12, 2016 at 10:21 pm
cg9m
you’re right..i also couldn’t find it in a regular search, but found a post on women (on my sis- which is relevant to me on my younger nieces now-) elsewhere: https://runwestchester.wordpress.com/2010/04/16/solving-the-5k-puzzle-other-stuff/
we disagreed about women being on the same starting line…
i need to disengage here now, tho- there are too many important battles to fight, and this isn’t one of them…i am sorry that the “racing” community seems so in-line with the hashtag-Trump agenda, tho..
i wonder if this battle will end up being a typeA vs typeB personality clash
please block me on any further comments to this site- it’s not one i want to have any further association with, and obviously your posts are ex opposito!
enjoy your victory!
November 12, 2016 at 10:46 pm
JoeGarland
Alas, you won’t be blocked. You must restrain yourself.
I see you did find a Semenya reference in the comments. Yet you never responded, then or now, to my comment in which I did not posit a conclusion one way or the other about “women being on the same starting line”. And nowhere is there evidence there that my “posts on caster semenya (LGBTQ) and disabled runners also smacked of prejudice and conceit”. Nor do you deign to point to my supposedly racist or anti-certain-types-of-immigrants statements.
You decided to malign me here yet when called out on it you are silent. You neither apologize nor defend yourself. This, too, saddens me.
November 13, 2016 at 8:28 am
Doug Humphries
cg9m just wants to be argumentative. He freaks out over a misspelling of Semenya when you never said anything derogative about her in the first place. Then he starts writing ‘Hashtag’ before several different subjects for absolutely no reason at all. The English language worked just fine before twitter and the # nonsense. All this venom when your entire point was never even critical of anyone to begin with. It was just an observation. I hope this ends here as cg9m wished.