There’ll be questions at the end, so bear with me on this.
The forecast had been down-graded throughout Friday, but I still expected there to be a patina of white when I awoke. Resigned to doing an hour or so on the treadmill in lieu of a long run, I found the lawn as green as it had been when I turned in. I understand Philly got hit with well over a foot, but we had nada.
But the radar suggested that there was snow in the area. Paul was down in Florida for the Masters HM champs so I had not planned to go into the City for the WSSAC run anyway, and with threatening weather I elected to head out but stay close enough to home to be able to get back if it started to snow.
So I meandered into Yonkers around Sarah Lawrence and other neighborhoods before picking up the BRP path. It was strange running in a spot with 45 minutes in my legs where there are usually only 15, and not in a good way.
But run I did, pushing on at 7, 7:10 pace, waving to JT on the way south, using care to get through short icy-spots, determined to get 1:45 in, which is how long I ran last Saturday. Then I figured I might as well go for 15. And so I did, my Garmin showing 15.01. New high, 1:47+, in over a year.
Here’s the thing. I am in awe of the many bloggers who not only go longer and longer but seem to relish it. (I’m too lazy to put up links, but they’re pretty well all of the folks in my must-read list.) It’s easy to say, “I’ll do 17″ or 20 or whatever, “get my mileage up,” but the doing is a different thing entirely. I don’t relish it. I head down my block and dread the many steps that lie ahead. I know it’s not a great frame-of-mind, and maybe that’s the problem. I go into speed-work knowing it’s likely hurt but am ready to do it. With this long stuff, it’s different. Boring, yes.
All of this, of course, plays into my concept about running the marathon this year. If I don’t I figure consistent 2 hour/17 milers will be fine, even for HMs. Marathon training, and add 30 minutes or so. (I can’t phathom the 22, 24, 26 mile runs.)
So here are the questions:
- How are you able to do long runs?
Did you struggle to get there?
12 comments
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February 6, 2010 at 5:23 pm
Alex
Joe, You are a much better / faster runner than I, and presumably your “long runs” are over much more quickly. So, just think, your 17 or 20 or whatever “milers” are over way before I’m done. My answers might be a bit silly just on this premise, but I’ll give it a shot anyway
How are you able to do long runs?
Preferably with a few good buddies, but not always easy to find ones that can. More often, I run alone. I do my first two to three miles very easy before I settle into what’s going to be my long run pace. A few things get me along. One, I usually mentally break my long runs up into half mile increments (e.g., 10 halves down, 22 to go for a 16 miler). It’s easier for my brain to digest. Also, I frequently have pace goals after the 3 mile point, and that also helps break it up. I’ll have sections of marathon paced miles, and often one, two, or three miles a little faster than race pace. I also don’t like to stop. If I can accomplish the run with between zero (on cold days) and two (on hot days) stops for water, all the better. I never carry anything. I’ll loop for a pickup somewhere.
Did you struggle to get there?
I’m faster now, and that is better. I actually find that I speed up a bit when I get more fatigued. I have to watch my pace carefully. Sure, I struggle(d). Sometimes I struggle a lot. But, I keep my eye on the goal, and know that I want it more than the present moment hurts or than my body is begging for a rest. Most of the time, I’ll just push through anything. But, I also learn to listen to my body more. I don’t run the super long ones. Instead, my workouts are designed to be fatiguing in other ways than distance (e.g., sub marathon pace miles or even intervals at the end). I typically will run most of them between 16 and 20 miles leading into the marathon. You will rarely catch me on my feet for more than two and a half hours.
For whatever its worth
The long run is yet another reason I usually devote part of the year to 5K training. I need a break from them. –Alex
February 6, 2010 at 5:34 pm
threlkeld
Yeah, you were motoring this morning. I was impressed (as always, but especially given all the black ice).
My longest run since I started back up has been ~14 miles. At around 2 hours, this still seems really short for a “long” run to me. I’m doing 12-14 twice a week now, and, given that I’m not training for a marathon this season, I’ll likely top out at 16 or so, unless it becomes clearer that I won’t run myself into the ground again by doing more.
Sorry for the background, but I mention it because over the past few years I got so used to running 18-22 miles on a weekly basis that anything shorter than that seems like a cheat. Which is another way of saying that the more long runs you do, the less of a big deal they are.
For me, the 3+ hour long run was something to look forward to and prepare for mentally. It was usually the highlight of my week, runningwise; it was the big reward at week’s end and the foundation for a lazy Sunday afternoon.
Running that long (sometimes up to 24 miles) also got easier once I started doing a weekly Tue/Wed run of 13-15 miles. It’s all a matter of perspective, I guess. And I couldn’t do the Sunday runs without music. One time the rights-management licenses on my older MP3 player crapped out and I only had one song on it that wasn’t rights managed: AC/DC’s “Highway to Hell.” I preferred to listen to that over and over again for three hours rather than nothing, and it turned out to be a surprisingly meditative exercise. I had a better experience doing this than this guy did (his mistake was picking Abba):
http://www.coudal.com/abbavideo.php
And, finally, three things you must not neglect: nutrition (meaning having adequate glycogen stores going in), hydration and sleep. You have to prepare for a big run just as you would a big race. So I’d start paying attention to that stuff on Thursday usually. And a fourth: recovery. Eat something with carbs and protein the minute you get in.
I miss those big runs up the Valhalla a lot these days.
Sorry for the logghoreic comment…
February 6, 2010 at 5:40 pm
threlkeld
I just realized I didn’t answer the second question. I agree with Alex on those two methods: break up the run into sections and do a slow “Kenyan-style” warmup (for me that means running in the 70-72% MHR range for the first three miles). Sometimes I stop at certain points for a minute or so to give myself a mental break too.
February 6, 2010 at 7:16 pm
herb
As to whether or not I struggled, I honestly don’t know the correct answer. In 2008 when I had to start all over I did only as much as I wanted. I had no goal, nor race in mind. Sure, I got tired and had to push; but that also could be enjoyable. I guess my point is, if there isn’t any mental pressure involved then it can easily be enjoyable. If it’s a chore of “having to get in the miles” then mentally the effort can feel significantly more.
As to how I’m able to do it, its something I look forward to on most days. Not necessarily the running, but the serene feeling of well being I carry around for the rest of the day. My best days are when I run long.
But there are also days where if the weather’s good, and things feels right, I might try to go out and hold my target marathon pace for the entire run. On the days I’m able to do that, things feel so great that I don’t want the running to stop.
Not to contradict myself on what I just said, but you may also be going at the wrong pace. If you’re not feeling easy and relaxed for the majority of it then perhaps you’re going too fast. I remember you mentioning more than once you do your easy days too fast. If you’re still building your base miles, then the long runs should be kept easy. – but I know you already know that.
February 6, 2010 at 10:25 pm
Flo
I like this post, makes me feel less alone while everyone else is adoring their long runs. I didn’t used to mind them so much but now that it’s 2 cycles in a row, I just want them over with. This is exacerbated by the weather, which is never as bad once I’m out in it, but it’s that point before when you’re sitting in a warm apartment looking at the trees blowing…it does not float my boat. Anyway, this doesn’t answer yours questions.
I’m able to because I have to. And usually it ends up being a nice run, but still, only because I have to.
Struggling: I keep mid-week long runs in the schedule, so there’s 12-14s going on. Those help make the LRs less foreign. And each time you go longer, the preceding distance is made easier.
February 6, 2010 at 10:26 pm
Flo
Forgot to say Congrats! Well done on the 15.
February 7, 2010 at 5:40 am
Ewen
1. I’m hardly able to do them.
2. I’m not there, but still struggle.
Yes, I’d rather an interval or tempo session. I’ve been stuck on 23k (14.3 miles) as a long run for a number of weeks. Running them with a group helps, but the last 5k is still hard.
What Julie said is true for me. When the mid-week ‘semi-long’ run gets up to 18-20k, then the weekend long run should be easier. That’s my hope!
February 7, 2010 at 9:08 am
Robert James Reese
In 2008, when I first started doing long runs, it was hell. It was the summer and I told myself that as soon as I finished up the ’08 Philly Marathon I was done. I loved running, but not that…
But then, something changed in my head. I don’t know what it was or why it happened (so I can’t tell anyone how to recreate it), but I suddenly found myself loving the long runs. The late mileage fatigue turned from a painful thing to be avoided into a comforting feeling, almost like a blanket. I guess I’m just lucky.
Of course, as others have noted, your long runs are a lot faster, so that could be part of why they are less enjoyable. I have rare days when I can stay in the low 7′s on them, but usually they are closer to 8′s. Maybe that change in thinking about the pace was what caused the shift from hate of the long run to love, because I know I didn’t always feel that way…
February 7, 2010 at 12:39 pm
nyflygirl
1. How are you able to do long runs?
Being that they are on a weekend, I find them easier to get in than runs during the week, where I have work around late nights at the office, social events, etc. Sometimes I did my long runs with teammates (we pacelead the NYRR Long Training Runs, we have an organized 20-miler that runs part of the NYCM course), but there were also times that it was just me and the iPod, and just liked to zone out and be creative with my routes.
2. Did you struggle to get there?
Definitely!! I remember the first time I did 15 I hit the wall with 2 miles to go. Definitely a learning experience (it was hot, I remember!)…part of it is trial and error with fueling, pacing, etc. I can’t say 20-milers are a cakewalk, but it’s a lot less intimidating than it once was.
February 7, 2010 at 1:35 pm
joegarland
In lieu of responding here, I put up a new post.
February 7, 2010 at 10:44 pm
Strep Again! « Law of Inertia
[...] wanted to stop by 15. At that point, I was headed back and began to think about someone’s recent blog post about struggling with long runs and the response I wrote. Ironic that my long run now just fizzled out and came to a crawl by the end. Ending with 18.25 [...]
February 8, 2010 at 2:20 pm
Jake
1.) Slowly. It’s a lot harder in the winter, bundled up like the Michelin man, and with all the water fountains in the city turned off. But besides that I truly love my long runs. I’ve had my wife and friends bike with me on these long runs, causing the miles to pass a lot more quickly, and I’ve been able to explore places I might never have seen otherwise (as evidenced by the photos on my blog). There’s nothing like a 20 mile run to make you realize how small NYC really is.
2.) Oh yeah. When I first started “building mileage” leading up to my first half marathons and then my first marathon, I injured myself repeatedly. And then during the summer, it was unbearably hot and raining most weekends. But through it all I became a much stronger runner, and I’m now running much higher mileage injury-free (knock on wood).